More TV Tropes Simple-Mindedness

I just wanted to tell you about the straw that broke the camel’s back here.

So what happened is, again on Skype, someone had just mentioned getting The Dracula X Chronicles, a PSP disc that collects Rondo of Blood and Symphony of the Night onto one UMD. He expressed displeasure at the fact that you have to actually unlock Symphony.

I chimed in agreeing with him, and wondering why Konami would even do that considering that Rondo and Symphony were both originally released separately and most people played Symphony before Rondo anyway. I opined that it’s advertised as a compilation and thus the two listed games are basic content, they shouldn’t be treated as bonuses.

Apparently, this is WRONG. The five or six other Tropers in that chat jumped down my throat and told me basically that it was bad that I had these beliefs and that I should just accept that Konami’s way is good and right. Their specific arguments (and I’m going to provide the chatlog on the comments so you can see for yourself) consisted of:

“Konami just wants people to appreciate Rondo!” (My rebuttal: people who buy it have the option of playing Rondo if they want to. They shouldn’t be forced to play it if they don’t want to)

“Rondo was never released in English before!” (see above)

“Symphony can be gotten millions of other ways, so what does it matter if they made you have to unlock it here?” (how is this a point for locking it? If anything, this is a point against)

“You can always just cheat” (the point is, you shouldn’t have to do anything)

“I like unlocking things.” (I do too, but that doesn’t mean always okay)

“Unlocking a second game is no different than being forced to play levels in order.” (Actually, its completely different because the two games were originally independent releases, on different consoles even. Seriously I can’t see why anyone would think this is a valid argument)

“Games have had unlockables for a long time, why does this bother you now?” (Rondo and SOTN were originally released separately, it makes no sense to make one an unlockable feature now. This is not the same thing as an unlockable character or stage or something, which is just a bonus feature in a game you already have access to)

“You’re being unreasonable.” (Konami wants me to pay cash for their product. I worked for that cash. Its you who is being unreasonable)

“You’re attacking anyone who doesn’t agree with you.” (Defending my beliefs is not attacking you)

“Just because you dislike something doesn’t mean its wrong.” (By the same token, being fine with something doesn’t mean its right)

I tried to explain my stance again and again, and how it makes no sense that a compilation forces you to play one game to unlock another. But… Tropers. They just wouldn’t get it. It was like explaining Taoism to a drunken monkey.

Let me explain, the problem isn’t that I had one disagreement… the problem is that this represents how MOST Troper arguments go. They try to blur distinctions so they can claim two unlike things are completely alike. They keep pointing out irrelevent trivia and saying its a major point. They invent “misunderstandings” so they can “correct” you. They keep trying to put words in your mouth or change the debate. Often they don’t understand what you’re trying to say (or pretend they don’t). They act like subjective preferences or their own apathy makes something okay. When all else fails, they fall back on claiming you’re attacking them or forcing your opinions or whatever when you’re actually not, and pull the “everything is subjective” card so they don’t have to think.

This is the final straw. I’ve blocked most of these people, and removed myself from this particular chatroom. I’ve had enough of TV Tropes childish, borderline retarded thought-processes and anti-intellectualism. It’s not good for my health.

Chatlog is in the comments section.


3 thoughts on “More TV Tropes Simple-Mindedness

  1. [9:28:05 PM] Stevebat: So Dracula X Chronicles is mocking me, All I want to do is play the remake of SOTN but I have to beat Rondo Of Blood first
    [9:28:24 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): No, you just have to find the game hidden in one of the levels.
    [9:28:26 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): XP
    [9:28:43 PM] Stevebat: Aw shit. Do you know how much hidden shit there is in this game?
    [9:28:48 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Same deal with the original Dracula X and the omake version.
    [9:29:00 PM] Edmond Dantes: That kind of shit bothers me. Why the hell not just make the game available from the main menu or something?
    [9:29:12 PM] Edmond Dantes: I remember Sonic Adventure DX did something similar with the Game Gear games.
    [9:29:26 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Because making the selling point available from the start isn’t a good idea when you’re putting another game in as that selling point.
    [9:29:35 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It’ll only guarantee that people would play just that.
    [9:29:43 PM | Edited 9:29:57 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): And not have any appreciation for where it came from.
    [9:30:47 PM] Stevebat: I do enjoy ROB mind you, Although I find the sheer amount of hidden stuff staggering, The completionist in me says to explore ALL of the passages
    [9:30:56 PM] Edmond Dantes: …. No offense Nomu but… if that’s really Konami’s thinking, then that is fucking. Retarded.
    [9:31:28 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Dude, Konami’s known for making their sweet stuff unlockable nowadays.
    [9:31:41 PM] Edmond Dantes: Oh. So Konami is just stupid then,
    [9:31:54 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): And people love them for it.
    [9:31:54 PM] Stevebat: Naw its their shtick, Its not dumb, its expected
    [9:31:56 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): : D
    [9:32:04 PM] Edmond Dantes: It’s dumb.
    [9:32:20 PM] Edmond Dantes: Because I could just buy it on the Playstation or in any other compilation where its NOT locked away and play it
    [9:32:37 PM] Edmond Dantes: Most people outside of Japan played SOTN independent of playing Rondo
    [9:32:51 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Exactly the point I was making, man.
    [9:33:05 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Konami wanted the players to appreciate the game that it’s a direct sequel to.
    [9:33:12 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Hence the remake.
    [9:33:33 PM] Stevebat: Drac X was the only Remake of Rondo outside of Japan
    [9:33:42 PM] Edmond Dantes: Yeah but… if people don’t want to play it, and just want to play the game they bought the collection for, then forcing them to unlock it is a dick move.
    [9:33:45 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): *cough*SNES*cough*
    [9:34:00 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It’s clever, not dickish.
    [9:34:07 PM] Edmond Dantes: No, its dickish.
    [9:34:09 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): You want a dick move?
    [9:34:16 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Putting in a game that sucks as an unlockable.
    [9:35:37 PM] Edmond Dantes: But seriously. The player spent his hard-earned money.
    [9:35:46 PM] Edmond Dantes: If he bought it for SOTN, he should be able to play SOTN without any question
    [9:35:58 PM] Stevebat: Bah, In that case I say use a strategy guide,
    [9:36:18 PM] Edmond Dantes: That would be like if the Metal Gear Solid collection forced you to beat Metal Gear Solid 1 before you could play Metal Gear Solid 2.
    [9:36:20 PM | Edited 9:36:25 PM] Stevebat: Online, Free. Not the stupid books
    [9:36:24 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): If you wanted to buy it for SOTN, you’d just buy SOTN online.
    [9:36:31 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): XP
    [9:36:50 PM] Edmond Dantes: ….. So basically, Konami can do no wrong.
    [9:37:26 PM] Edmond Dantes: You buy Drac X Chronicles, you do it Konami’s way. Nevermind that its YOUR money, they’re your masters, if they say you have to jump through hoops, you have to jump through hoops.
    [9:37:38 PM] Edmond Dantes: I’ll remember that if Nintendo ever makes a Mario game where the Jump button has to be unlocked
    [9:38:27 PM] Edmond Dantes: Granted, for me it wouldn’t matter–I own SOTN–but if I was someone who never played it before and bought it just to play SOTN and they threw that shit at me, I’d be pissed. And rightfully so.
    [9:39:03 PM] Edmond Dantes: I mean I’m not against unlockables. But don’t call it a compilation and then force me to play the games in a specific order.
    [9:39:20 PM] Edmond Dantes: That is just dickish.
    [9:39:45 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Well, you don’t have to beat the game to unlock SOTN.
    [9:39:58 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): You can just find the game, clear the stage it’s in, then quit out to menu and play it.
    [9:40:08 PM] Edmond Dantes: Even so, why should I have to?
    [9:40:25 PM] Edmond Dantes: Especially when, in real life–as you yourself pointed out–there are many ways to get just SOTN by itself?
    [9:40:40 PM] Edmond Dantes: Why make it unlockable in this ONE compilation when its available by itself elsewhere?
    [9:40:43 PM] Stevebat: @Nom, Where is the game BTW?
    [9:40:44 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Because it’s three – technically four – games for the price of one?
    [9:41:30 PM] Edmond Dantes: But if you put an arbitrary barrier to playing the games there, then that undermines the value
    [9:41:58 PM] Stevebat: Meanwhile at Sega, Sonic Genesis collection…
    [9:42:00 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Stage 2, Steve.
    [9:42:15 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Take the route to Stage 3′.
    [9:42:32 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Then go the upper route whenever you can. Have the axe.
    [9:42:45 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): You’ll find a vine cage eventually, which you can cut free with the axe.
    [9:43:02 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Then you can jump to the upper ledges and find a breakable tombstone with the game inside.
    [9:44:36 PM] Stevebat: Ah. Kay
    [9:45:03 PM] Edmond Dantes: @Steve – Does that Genesis collection also do stupid “unlockable” crap? I know Sonic Mega Collection and Sonic Gems do
    [9:45:25 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It does.
    [9:45:28 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): I have it on PSP.
    [9:45:34 PM] Swasfews: some people like unlocking stuff
    [9:45:45 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): You have to get high scores or beat games to unlock other games.
    [9:46:15 PM] Philip Allen: Sonic Gems Collection is fun as hell.
    [9:46:28 PM] Edmond Dantes: @Swas – That doesn’t mean that everything should be an unlockable.
    [9:46:37 PM] Philip Allen: As for Genesis, I just used someone else’s save to get everything
    [9:46:40 PM] Edmond Dantes: Some things should be. But things like this shouldn’t be
    [9:47:00 PM] Edmond Dantes: If its a compilation of games, then there is no reason to force people to play one game to unlock another.
    [9:47:04 PM] Edmond Dantes: No reason at all.
    [9:47:12 PM] Stevebat: Eh, Level 2 is stupidly easy to get to anyways. The difficulty spike isn’t until the third level
    [9:47:42 PM] Stevebat: Also, Dullahan is evil
    [9:49:06 PM] Swasfews: I dunno. I wouldn’t be buying a collection for a single game; I’d be buying it because I would want to play most/all of them. Requiring me to play some of them to get more makes me feel like I got more for the price instead of just ignoring them. I’m not going to try and convince you though, because it’s clear it’s not going to work.
    [9:49:39 PM] Edmond Dantes: It’s not.
    [9:50:22 PM] Edmond Dantes: Especially considering that all the games are available separately anyway. So its ultimately pointless to force me to jump through hoops to unlock them in a collection, when I could just get on eBay and buy the original cartridges.
    [9:50:26 PM] Edmond Dantes: or CDs
    [9:50:34 PM] Edmond Dantes: Besides.
    [9:50:47 PM] Edmond Dantes: What if I buy a compilation and the one game I wanted to play turned out to be locked?
    [9:51:01 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Technically, only one game was available separate out of the four.
    [9:51:09 PM] Stevebat: Then you use a strategy guide and cheat to get the game you want
    [9:52:11 PM] Swasfews: Seems silly to buy a whole collection for a single game, but I guess if it’s old or rare, it makes sense. Again, I wouldn’t buy a collection for one game, though.
    [9:52:48 PM] Stevebat: In value terms, Rondo of Blood is probably the most important game for Dracula X Chronicles considering it was never released in the US up until this point
    [9:53:08 PM] Edmond Dantes: Sigh…
    [9:53:37 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): And neither was the joke game bundled within it.
    [9:53:55 PM] gingerninja666: off to bed
    [9:54:02 PM] gingerninja666: night
    [9:54:10 PM] Swasfews: If someone bought a castlevania collection for sotn, I wouldn’t know what to say because it can be bought on its own a ton of ways.
    [9:54:22 PM] Edmond Dantes: That’s the point, Swas.
    [9:54:24 PM] Swasfews: Night.
    [9:54:27 PM] Edmond Dantes: Okay, better question.
    [9:54:38 PM] Stevebat: Ginger going to bed so early?
    [9:54:44 PM] Edmond Dantes: Is there any good reason it SHOULD be locked on a compilation like this?
    [9:55:37 PM] Edmond Dantes: You guys keep making excuses for it. So tell me, why is it so good that they forced you to unlock it?
    [9:56:09 PM] Stevebat: To give players a carrot for playing through the game?
    [9:56:10 PM] Edmond Dantes: So far, I’ve heard that
    * it’s easy
    * you should be buying Drac X Chornicles for the other game anyway and its only right that they force you to play that first because… why exactly?
    [9:56:18 PM] Swasfews: [9:45 PM] Swasfews:

    <<< some people like unlocking stuff
    [9:56:30 PM] Philip Allen: What Stevebat said… I don't like it, but that's a good point
    [9:56:57 PM] Edmond Dantes: [9:56 PM] Swasfews:

    <<< some people like unlocking stuffSo put in unlockables. But the unlockables should NEVER be something that should be basic content.
    [9:57:36 PM] Edmond Dantes: [9:56 PM] Stevebat:

    <<< To give players a carrot for playing through the game?Which is dickish, because its a separate game altogether and they were originally released separately. Players should be allowed to choose which game they want to play, immediately.
    [9:57:58 PM] Edmond Dantes: Besides.
    [9:58:02 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Actually, you're getting it wrong.
    [9:58:11 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): The original was never released in English.
    [9:58:11 PM] Edmond Dantes: If the players seriously want to play Rondo of Blood, they'll play it.
    [9:58:23 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): The remake bundles both the original and SOTN.
    [9:58:52 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It gives a chance to people who wanted to play the missing Castlevania title but couldn't import it.
    [9:59:21 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Plus the story gets expanded on in the remake, with the addition of more cutscenes.
    [9:59:47 PM] Edmond Dantes: Sigh. You're dodging the question, Nomu. Now you're saying its okay for Konami to be dickish because its an unreleased (at least in English) game and that… somehow makes it okay for people to be forced to play it even if its not the one they want to play.
    [10:00:02 PM] Edmond Dantes: No.
    [10:00:04 PM] Edmond Dantes: Seriously.
    [10:00:35 PM] Edmond Dantes: I can't believe there are people–Americans, at that–who are okay with paying THEIR money for a COLLECTION of games, only to be told that they can only play the games when the COMPANY says they can.
    [10:00:56 PM] Edmond Dantes: That would be like if my DVD player had a chip in it that forced me to watch Dr. No before I could watch From Russia With Love
    [10:01:34 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Jesus Christ, why even play video games then? It sounds like unlockables in general piss you off.
    [10:01:55 PM] Edmond Dantes: Nomu, you sound like you don't even read what people say.
    [10:02:00 PM] Edmond Dantes: I repeat:
    [10:02:23 PM] Edmond Dantes: Unlockables are fine. But this is a compilation–its explicitly marketed as such. Both the games are *basic content*.
    [10:02:42 PM] Edmond Dantes: They shouldn't be treated as a bonus feature if they're basically the main reason you bought the thing.
    [10:02:49 PM] Swasfews: What's the full list of games in it
    [10:03:20 PM] Stevebat: Rondo Of Blood Remake, SOTN, Rondo Of Blood Original Emulation, Some random game that I never heard about
    [10:03:21 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): The Rondo of Blood remake, the Rondo of Blood original, SOTN, and the bonus game from the original Rondo of Blood.
    [10:03:28 PM] Stevebat: Owned
    [10:05:42 PM] Edmond Dantes: Yeah, okay, fine. Just tune me out. You can't explain why I'm wrong, so you're just gonna ignore me.
    [10:06:10 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): We don't understand your problem.
    [10:06:13 PM | Edited 10:06:21 PM] Swasfews: It seems rather explicit that, even though it's a compilation, that Rondo of Blood is the main focus and that SOTN IS meant to be a bonus for people who unlock it.
    [10:06:32 PM] Edmond Dantes: You don't understand my problem? YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND MY PROBLEM?
    [10:06:41 PM] Edmond Dantes: My, fucking, god. How can you *not* understand?
    [10:07:25 PM] Edmond Dantes: It's a compilation. Compilations are collections of games. The different games in it are *basic fucking content*.
    [10:07:28 PM] Swasfews: I understand it, but I don't see it as a problem. Like I said, I love unlocking things. I was disappointed in UMvC3 that you had all the characters at the start for example.
    [10:07:57 PM] Edmond Dantes: You don't buy a James Bond DVD set and then get told "you have to watch Dr. No before From Russia With Love" Why the fuck would you buy a video game collection and be told you have to play one game before playing another?
    [10:08:14 PM] Edmond Dantes: Swas.
    [10:08:25 PM] Edmond Dantes: Those kinds of unlockables are completely different.
    [10:08:40 PM] Edmond Dantes: Bonus characters and costumes are, well, bonuses. But you're still able to play the main game.
    [10:09:06 PM] Edmond Dantes: In this case, we're literally talking about a game that, on the back of the box, says it comes with two games… and then when you play it, it forces you to play one to play the other.
    [10:09:08 PM] Edmond Dantes: That.
    [10:09:10 PM] Edmond Dantes: Is.
    [10:09:12 PM] Edmond Dantes: Bullshit.
    [10:11:33 PM] Stevebat: A game that is designed around having all their levels played in a linear order is the same concept is it not? For example Sonic 3 and Knuckles requires you to play the Sonic 3 stages before the Knuckles stages
    [10:11:52 PM] Stevebat: Konami could have just required ROB to be beaten before SOTN unlocks for plot related purposes
    [10:12:28 PM] Stevebat: Also, Disagreeing with something fundamentally does not make it wrong or horrible, It just means you don't like it.
    [10:12:55 PM] Edmond Dantes: Okay, Steve? That's a terrible argument on multiple levels.
    [10:13:21 PM] Edmond Dantes: One, you're pointedly wrong about Sonic and Knuckles–if you put in Sonic and Knuckles by itself you can skip the Sonic 3 levels.
    [10:13:27 PM] Edmond Dantes: You just miss some BONUS content.
    [10:13:27 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Honestly, this is getting nowhere. You're sounding exactly like Ginger at this point.
    [10:14:17 PM] Edmond Dantes: Two, we're not talking about "play level one before level two," we're talking about "play one game that was originally available by itself on CD-ROM before being allowed to play another game that was originally available separately on CD at some point."
    [10:14:32 PM | Edited 10:15:04 PM] Edmond Dantes: Three, about "disagreeing doesn't make it wrong," I'll remember that next
    [10:14:57 PM | Edited 10:15:19 PM] Stevebat:
    [10:16:46 PM] Edmond Dantes: [10:13 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum):

    <<< Honestly, this is getting nowhere. You're sounding exactly like Ginger at this point.It seems like anyone who has a strong stance on anything sounds like Ginger to you, regardless of content or context.
    [10:17:24 PM] Stevebat: If by strong stance you mean Attacking Anyone Who Disagrees, then yes
    [10:17:44 PM] Edmond Dantes: I haven't attacked anyone. Except in the retracted statement, which is exactly why it was retracted.
    [10:17:48 PM] Edmond Dantes: And besides that…
    [10:18:25 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): "I DISAPPROVE OF THIS TELL ME WHY I SHOULD APPROVE"
    [10:18:39 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): *shoot down every argument everyone else makes with nitpicking points*
    [10:18:49 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): *repeat for infinity or until bored or until frustrated*
    [10:19:02 PM] Edmond Dantes: Ginger gets upset about villains in cartoons. I'm getting upset at something that's become a bad trend in a hobby I enjoy, and which I'm supposed to spend money on and just accept without a good reason.
    [10:19:07 PM] Swasfews: *grabs tea*
    [10:19:14 PM] Swasfews: forgot the tea, nom
    [10:20:03 PM] Edmond Dantes: Seriously, not being able to see the difference between my rants and Ginger's, is like not being able to see the difference between G1 and FIM Ponies because they're both ponies
    [10:20:17 PM] Stevebat: I would suggest not to buy from the companies that have bad trends, but unfortunately the number of idiots who buy anyways is staggering
    [10:20:17 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It's not about subject.
    [10:20:21 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): It's about formula.
    [10:20:34 PM] Edmond Dantes: Ignoring the subject is just ignorant, Nomu
    [10:21:47 PM] Edmond Dantes: Seriously, if everyone's the same as long as they rant… well, then, what's the difference between Ginger's rants about villains, and an episode of AVGN, for example?
    [10:22:07 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): AVGN is done partially in jest.
    [10:22:11 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): Ginger's is completely serious.
    [10:22:29 PM] Edmond Dantes: Now look whose nitpicking
    [10:22:31 PM] Stevebat: Does AVGN ever rant about games he actually enjoys?
    [10:22:53 PM] Edmond Dantes: @Stevebat – Actually yes. He did a four-part series on Castlevania
    [10:22:57 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): You asked for a difference. I responded.
    [10:23:06 PM] Nomuru2d (James Meldrum): And it's an obvious difference.
    [10:23:33 PM] Stevebat: AVGN does his rants to entertain, Its his shtick, Ginger rants to try to get others to understand him
    [10:24:43 PM] Stevebat: In other news I need to figure out a cheap cosplay for youmacon
    [10:24:51 PM] Edmond Dantes: [10:20 PM] Stevebat:

    <<< I would suggest not to buy from the companies that have bad trends, but unfortunately the number of idiots who buy anyways is staggeringAgreed here. Which is partially why I avoid most games nowadays–at least until I do research and make sure there's no bullshit.
    [10:25:18 PM] Stevebat: For example, the COD series boggles me that people buy the same game over and over again
    [10:26:16 PM] Edmond Dantes: But anyway…
    [10:27:12 PM] Edmond Dantes: I actually take back my words about Sonic Adventure DX earlier. That was a stand-alone game that, in a re-release, just happened to include game gear games. That's kinda fine since they're not a main selling point.
    [10:27:31 PM] Stevebat: (The Game Gear GAmes sorta sucked anyways)
    [10:27:41 PM] Edmond Dantes: But in cases like Sonic Gems or Dracula X Chronicles, the games advertised are *the whole reason you're buying the collection*
    [10:28:27 PM] Edmond Dantes: So, there's literally no reason to keep them squirreled away.
    [10:28:45 PM] Edmond Dantes: They should be basic features, available from the outset.
    [10:29:13 PM] Edmond Dantes: If Dracula X chronicles was called "Rondo of Blood" and SOTN was listed as a bonus, then making it unlcokable would be okay.
    [10:29:24 PM] Edmond Dantes: But its called Dracula X Chronicles and the whole point is that it includes both.
    [10:29:57 PM] Edmond Dantes: And if that's not CLEAR ENOUGH, then I don't know what else to say
    [10:30:49 PM] Edmond Dantes: Seriously, I can't believe I even had to make this case, and that I'm being treated like I'm wrong for not just accepting the way things are like a good little boy.
    [10:32:26 PM] Stevebat: [10:31 PM] Edmond Dantes:

    <<< I can't believe I even had to make this caseYou might want to eliminate that idea, Someone will ALWAYS disagree with something
    [10:34:32 PM] Edmond Dantes: Yeah, I know. I've literally seen people argue that the sun isn't hot
    [10:39:30 PM] Stevebat: In other news MFW the Trope page for Castlevania 2, Wow so much for Neutrality, half the page is spent trying to claim that the game is actually good
    [10:42:39 PM] Stevebat: Something tells me an editor took offense to all the videos bashing said game
    [10:42:47 PM] Chad: Check out the ymmv section.

  2. Is the Japanese version packaged like that? (“Now…together at last”, with pictures of both games on the back given equal billing)? The packaging does imply the player is getting a collection rather than a new remake that may have hidden bonuses (I think the developers meant the SOTN copy to be a reward for beating it, not a selling point).

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